The Ended Flyers Thread

[bkeich]

If they did go full rebuild what do you do with Giroux and Voracek at this point?

Yes, that is the issue. I dont know that "full rebuild" is really what I mean, we have a strong farm system, so you dont need to go full rebuild and hope for success in 5 years, but I would look to start moving some of our 30 year old players for something now.

I dont see this team being much of a threat next year either, we just dont have the talent. So anybody that is not in the 2020-21 season plans should be moved.

A little disappointed in what we got for Simmonds, but I understand he is a FA at the end of the year so his value is a little diminished. Basically we got a younger, less talented version of Simmonds and a 3rd round pick, not terrible, but I would rather have just gotten a higher pick. Hartman is not a guy that I am really that excited about, but he is a possible 2nd line guy in the near future.

JVR to me is just adding to our "the whole team is 30" problem we may have soon, his contract might soon be a big albatross, if I could move him I would.

A little disappointing to see someone get something for Jordan Weal, who we basically gave away. Oddly enough it is former Flyer draft pick Michael Chaput, who is not exactly a great prospect either. I guess it was a trade between two teams looking to move two square pegs in hopes of finding a round peg.

[bigegypt0417]

the flyers roster is a good balance of young and old. If I'm not mistaken they are among the younger teams in the NHL.

Simmonds contract demands are pretty unrealistic IMO.

[Florida_Sunshine]

What were his demands? I’ve never seen a number.

[zambonir]

I don't know that they are unreasonable, whatever they may be. Just not a good fit given his age and where the Flyers are.

[bigegypt0417]

5 years is what I remember from the summer...

[zambonir]

I can find articles that suggested he might want (or deserve) as many as 6 to 8 years (the latter to spread out the AAV). A big ask at his age certainly. I think with Giroux, Voracek and JVR, just wasn't gonna happen, even if the open market doesn't prove to be much better.

The last eight-nine years have really been a drag. The Carter-Richards housecleaning ultimately led to nothing better, even if a few of those individual stories remain unwritten. Between the Bryzgalov signing and not going full rebuild in 2013-2014, here we are. One first-round series win over Pittsburgh is the only highlight since that Cup final.

[xogfog]

The Flyers will be in good shape going forward. Elliot, Neuvirth, Raffl, Lehtera, come off the books. Talbot is also a free agent, if the Flyers can get him on a good deal, he'll stay as Hart's backup. They will have the cap space to sign a marquee free agent forward. The will also add Frost, so forwards will be Giroux, Couturier, Voracek, JVR, Konecky, Frost, Lindblom, Laugton, Patrick, Hartman, free agent, and one of Rubtsov or Vorobyov.

On Defense, unless they trade one of the young defensemen for something, The have Ghost, Provorov, Sandheim, Myers, Hagg, Gudas and Morin. McDonald's albatross contract is still on the books for next year, but if they can't unload him, he might end up on the Phantoms after he clears waivers unclaimed so his salary won't count on the cap, like they had done before.

[zambonir]

I agree the future is still pretty bright (and credit to Hextall for a lot of that too) but there's also nowhere to go but up. It's just a huge reversal of fortune in the big picture, for years the Flyers almost never missed the playoffs and could be counted on to cycle into the conference finals with some regularity, even in the cap era, while, in the meantime the city's other teams were disappointing. Now, if the Sixers can get there, the Flyers will have the longest drought, and the Phillies and Eagles are probably closer to another one too.

[xogfog]

So, assuming the Flyers do have the cap space, which it looks like they will, to sign a marquee free agent, what would you guys prefer.

A. Try to sign a top line winger like Mark Stone or Artemi Panarin.

B. Sign defenseman Erik Karlsson and trade one of the young defensemen.

My personal preference would be to try to sign Panarin, but the allure of true # 1 defenseman in Karlsson reminds me of what getting Desjardins and Pronger did for former Flyer teams.

[bkeich]

So, assuming the Flyers do have the cap space, which it looks like they will, to sign a marquee free agent, what would you guys prefer.

A. Try to sign a top line winger like Mark Stone or Artemi Panarin.

B. Sign defenseman Erik Karlsson and trade one of the young defensemen.

My personal preference would be to try to sign Panarin, but the allure of true # 1 defenseman in Karlsson reminds me of what getting Desjardins and Pronger did for former Flyer teams.

That is a tough call because the combination of Karlsson and Hart could result in alot of wins. The problem with single players like that is they are only on the ice 33-40% of the time, but guys like Pronger change the whole team, he not only played at a level we hadnt seen but he brought the whole defense up with him. Karlsson is somewhat (lesser) like that too, I think that would be my vote, especially since we are going to have a very young and talented defense for awhile I suspect.

[flyers19rw]

IMO, the best route for the Flyers to go in order to improve the club would be through the trade route. The two most serious needs are for a top level right handed defenseman and forwards who are responsible for play over the total rink. In the past the Flyers have been able to obtain a leader on defense via a trade-Desjardins, Timonen and Pronger come to mind. Such player would be costly but that's the best way to get a guy that you'd want.
Up front, there are several players who treat defense as an optional style of play. In particular, JVR and Voracek just leave the defense hanging out do dry in their own end way too much. Perhaps a new coach who put in a defensive scheme that would correct this situation would solve the issue. It doesn't matter how the problem is resolved but it needs to be done.
Fletcher's move of Simmonds yesterday clearly illustrates that he is willing to break up the old core in order to re-fashion the club. So moving "name" players in a trade to get the help that is needed on the blue line probably has to happen. Also the club has a surplus of defensemen so trading Gudas and/or Gostisbehere is an option.
Its should be uninteresting summer for the Flyers between making trades and signing essential RFAs to new deals.

[Squire]

Didn't stone agree to an extension with Vegas like yesterday?

My idea to improve the team is to bring up the kids and let them all play

[flyers19rw]

I'm all for letting the young guys show what they have. Myers and Morin in particular on defense. NAK up front. If Frost's season ends before the Flyers does, they need to give him an ATO in either LV or Philly.
I don't believe that Gordon is the guy to coach the club next season. However by playing these young guys now, it will give the new coach some idea of who can play. Its too late in the year to put in a completely new system of play but in fall camp there will be one implemented.

[Austinfan]

Panarin is rumored to go to Fla and EK wants to stay on the West Coast.
There may not be any "name" free agents worth chasing.
Nor do the Flyers really need one, with Hart and Talbot/Lyon in goal they'll be a much stronger team to start the season, the kids will be a year older, and they'll be deeper even before they make any moves.

Flyers have a lot of talent coming up, and the cap room and flexibility to make one or two deals to reshape the roster. Myers and Morin have joined the team, NAK and Vorobyev will get a cameo, next year LHV will be loaded with Rubtsov, Laberge, Kase, Bunnaman, Twarynski being joined by Ratcliffe, Strome, possibly Allison, Laczynski, Kalynuk, Wylie, Hogberg, Sandstrom and maybe Ustimenko.
And they have 10 picks in the upcoming draft.

My untouchables: Giroux, Couts, Patrick, Lindblom, Sanheim, Provorov, Myers, Frost, Farabee.
The last two are exempt from the expansion draft which makes them more valuable.

[zambonir]

There may not be any "name" free agents worth chasing.
Nor do the Flyers really need one,

Sometimes I think you're a bot AF

But your untouchables list is small. That opens a lot of trade possibilities for sure. I think a top D-man is intriguing, let the forwards keep growing.

[zambonir]

"Simmonds will strongly consider the Flyers when free agency opens July 1, according to a source. “He loves Philadelphia. It’s home to him,” the source said"

Flyers’ Claude Giroux on feisty Ryan Hartman: ‘Orange and black is going to look...

(it rarely happens, but...?)

[Austinfan]

Simmonds isn't coming back unless the FA market for him is totally dry, b/c Hartman is a better 5x5 player just off his first game, faster, more agile, more skilled and just as feisty (and fighting has limited value in today's NHL). With JVR on the first PP, he has less value there as well. So he'd have to accept a 4th line, 2nd PP role and the limited money that goes with that role.

[xogfog]

Flyers are still playing great.even with Hart out. Sandheim is playing great, and Myers looks like he belongs. Provorov is back to playing like a #1 and there is no letdown after moving Simmonds. Took Columbus to OT, handily beat the Devils and the Islanders at their places.

Playoffs still a very long shot, but encouraging to see, if they play this well for the rest of the season, do you make Gordon the head coach or still try to hire someone else (Quenneville)?

[zambonir]

It's an interesting question. Never a big fan of making decisions based on an interim run but he's a good and not inexperienced coach with connections to a lot of the roster from LV, plus he's a former goalie (there was a column the other day suggesting that's been good for Hart). Maybe his time with the Islanders was like Francona's time with the Phillies.

Chicago wound up making Quenneville look pretty good too; if he'd gotten the Flyers job after St. Louis and Colorado it wouldn't have been that exciting. Hiring the big-name vets has generally worked for the Flyers even if they don't tend to last long (but longer than the other guys).

I assume there might be some other candidates associated with Fletcher. And some competition for Quenneville.

[bigegypt0417]

Playoffs still a very long shot, but encouraging to see, if they play this well for the rest of the season, do you make Gordon the head coach or still try to hire someone else (Quenneville)?

17 games left and only down 5 points...it's definitely doable.