Phillies Hot Stove Discussion 2021-22

[BostonRoss]

I would pursue any good player regardless of whether we think we have a prospect to fill his position in the next couple of years. It wasn’t that long ago that we thought we were all set at 3B.

[fish]

There are four or five FA's who play SS so it seems more likely we could find a worthwhile FA at SS than 3b.

I'm not giving Didi anything more than a utility position- which may suit him well and still provide a lot of value to the Phils. Kyle Seager is a chance to add thump and cover a hole a third for a year while still leaving plenty of flexibility for SS or other pieces- I wouldn't want him for any more than a year and 13 million unless he'd sign on for something like 2 years and 20 million. I haven't seen much of Kyle Seager for the last few years, so if some says he's a butcher at third, then I'd change my mind- but the numbers seem to suggest he's average.

I think Stott at 3b might be asking for problems. He seems to have a good nose for the game, but he has the body and tools for the middle infield

[andyb]

So Stott moves to 2b.?

Scouts generally say that might be his best position. He does have a strong arm though so it is tempting to see if a SS can succeed with below average range and a good arm. The Cal Ripken model.

The key thing with Stott is that the bat looks major league quality. He'll fit somewhere by 2023. Hopeful about Luis Garcia too, though still probably in the 50-50 range that he can be a major league starter. And if Bohm does not last at 3B remember we need three infielders. Not sure we have a great 3rd answer (Torres is not that answer at the moment. Whether Maton or a revived Kingery could hold down a position are other questions). The guy with big tools that would be nice to see develop I think is Jamari Baylor.

[Austinfan]

Baylor to me is more like a 2024-2025 ETA, he's raw and needs a lot of work and is a high risk prospect.
If Stott has the arm for SS, if he lacks range, 3B would be viable, 2B is easier to fill so 3B would have more value.

Just can't see Bohm - Didi on the left side - that's butt ugly.

Though they'll give Bohm another year to try and make it work, long-term is either Stott/Simmons/Baylor or someone out of the organization. Bohm could be a decent LF/1B down the road, he's not a bad athlete but not smooth enough for 3B.

[fish]

Nola for Berrios anyone? Both under contract through 2023, Nola with an extension and Berrios via arbitration. Berrios a year younger. They are pretty much the same pitcher, but in the interest of a roster shakeup I wouldn't be upset to see Nola go if he was replaced in kind.

[bkox]

why would the Jays make this trade?

[bkox]

Phillies’ offseason shopping strategy: Think Costco, not Gucci

[fish]

why would the Jays make this trade?

The Jays may love Berrios, I don't know- but he gets blown up on the frequency that Nola does. and after giving up the prospects they did, maybe they feel they can't move on from him so quickly. But if you were an outside unbiased 3rd party, say the Dodgers- would you want Nola or Berrios? I'd wager Nola.

For has good as Nola has been, he just doesn't win when they need him to. He's not a "has to go" guy, but the team needs some signiant shakeup.

[bkeich]

Not sure we should invest in 3B. Remember that is a backup position for Didi if Bohm does not have a great year. I just think we have bigger problems to address and maybe a year down the road we are even looking at Stott there, especially if we address shortstop with someone on a multi-year deal.

What the Phillies do with Bohm and whether they pencil him in at a position is one of the most interesting questions of the offseason. Counting on him would be rolling the dice, but would it in the long run be a worse gamble compared to committing $10-$15 million to someone to cover the position (and thereby wasting a potential plus Bohm contribution and taking the money from elsewhere).

I really can't see not penciling in Bohm in the starting lineup next year, from day 1. He had a horrible first half of the season, but he was turning it around. He hit much, much better after his horrible start. He should be our 3B until he proves he can't do it, and he hasnt done that. He was bad, but many players are bad fielders when they start out, he wasnt so bad that his fielding should keep him off the team, it was just really bad. It wasnt a bad idea to get him away from the spotlight and go to AAA and work on some things, but this team has so many things to fix that frankly we really need him to play somewhere, and 3B is the best position to start with. Maybe LF is in his future, but not yet. No matter what, he absolutely must be in the lineup in April barring injury, he is really the only young player on the team. Stott will hopefully join him soon, but we MUST have some youth on the team to keep costs down and at the moment he is the ONLY young position player worth anything at all.

Kingery, Haseley, Moniak and even Quinn (still sorta young) are all completely worthless at the moment to the major league team. They have all implied, to various degrees, that they cannot play in the major leagues. Some of them may reverse that impression, but at the moment none of them are really even prospects anymore. We need Bohm, he should have a VERY long leash because there is no one pulling on the other end.

[Austinfan]

Moniak is only 23, a little early to write him off, given the lost year and the way he got jacked around last season.
Kingery and Haseley are ??? Strange situation in both cases. Could solve CF if they can be salvaged.
Quinn is gone.
If they could find a CF, might get by with Vierling/Moniak in LF at some point in the season.

Still, it'll be hard to be much worse than Cutch/Herrera/Miller and their cumulative 3.3 WAR in 1343 WAR.
Well, there is Knapp, who managed -1.5 WAR.

[andyb]

That is kind of where I am with Bohm. To be a good team we probably need to get production for a low cost from a young player somewhere. I just don't see any other place they can obviously get it from. They clearly are not moving Bohm position-wise over the winter. Hopefully they have a backup for 3B better than Torreyes or Galvis. That might involve having a corner infield backup that can also play 3B (Miller can, but not sure he can play it well enough).

[bigegypt0417]

So here's my question...why wouldn't they move bohm to get his bat in the line-up? I agree he was pretty awful for the last few weeks but i think that may have been the impacts of his defensive struggles because he was hitting well in July and August.

I think if you move him to LF, his bat still plays.

[bkeich]

So here's my question...why wouldn't they move bohm to get his bat in the line-up? I agree he was pretty awful for the last few weeks but i think that may have been the impacts of his defensive struggles because he was hitting well in July and August.

I think if you move him to LF, his bat still plays.

But his bat his less useful as a LF than a 3B. Just like you expect more from your 1B than your catcher, generally there is a long held list of what the order is of offense from different positions. The Phils have an advantage as our catcher is a good hitter (not normal), but we have black holes at CF, SS and LF (and 3B possibly). LF is the 2nd most offensive position, 3B is either 3rd or 4th in this list (along with RF).

Additionally, you want Bohm at 3B because it is easier to find a LF than a 3B. If you move him than it is harder to find a replacement for him that could hit well enough to hold on to the position.

[bigegypt0417]

So here's my question...why wouldn't they move bohm to get his bat in the line-up? I agree he was pretty awful for the last few weeks but i think that may have been the impacts of his defensive struggles because he was hitting well in July and August.

I think if you move him to LF, his bat still plays.

But his bat his less useful as a LF than a 3B. Just like you expect more from your 1B than your catcher, generally there is a long held list of what the order is of offense from different positions. The Phils have an advantage as our catcher is a good hitter (not normal), but we have black holes at CF, SS and LF (and 3B possibly). LF is the 2nd most offensive position, 3B is either 3rd or 4th in this list (along with RF).

Additionally, you want Bohm at 3B because it is easier to find a LF than a 3B. If you move him than it is harder to find a replacement for him that could hit well enough to hold on to the position.

looking at the crop of free agents, LF doesn't seem a position of depth...there is Kyle Schwarber (if there is a mutual decline)and then....cutch?

Do you move a useful bat to LF in order to get a better bat at a more depth filled position?

Perhaps you go after Kris Bryant? You have a guy on your roster who can help with that recruitment...

[andyb]

Yeah, I think the Phillies just think the bat plays better at 3B than in LF and they believe his defense will improve.

Bohm should hit. There is no reason to think that last season was an indication of serious questions about his bat. His exit velocity was fine the bat definitely improved over the course of the season. June 1 through the end of the season he was .293/.361/.383. Not great, but not awful either and one has to assume the power will improve.

We all talk about how the hitting coaches messed up our favorite prospect (insert Moniak, Vierling, Haseley, Kingery), but maybe their work with Bohm was the biggest problem. Maybe we should send him to West Virginia in the offseason to spend some time learning from Charlie.

[andyb]

Do you move a useful bat to LF in order to get a better bat at a more depth filled position?

One could make Miller the platoon left fielder with a right handed partner and sign Marte to play CF. Marte eventually slides to LF when one of the kids in CF is ready (Muzziotti, Rojas most likely).

That type of move probably leaves you enough money to get a closer and a SS picking from the second tier of free agents (and not the Correas).

[bigegypt0417]

Is Kimbrel the closer?

there doesn't seem to be a whole lot out there other than him...although i'm sure the yankees may make Chapman available?

[andyb]

How about Raisel Iglesias?

Raisel Iglesias Stats | Baseball-Reference.com

A bit younger and does not have the expensive reputation. He won't be cheap but might be more in the $10-$12 million AAV range.

[bigegypt0417]

I like him over Kimbrel.

[flyers19rw]

You are correct-Bohm should hit and probably well enough to compensate for his defensive deficiencies. I don’t want to see the Phillies mess with him at the plate as they have want to do with so many other of their prospects. They knew what he was when they drafted- a guy that should hit for average; alley power that might get 15-20 home runs per season. He’s never been a masher. If they wanted that, they should have drafted someone else.
The organization has to stop trying to bang square pegs into round holes. Accept what their draftees are and quit messing with them. Too many guys are talking about having to go to batting sessions in the off season to get back to where they were before having their stroke and approach altered by Phillies staff.