Phillies at the Trade Deadline

[zambonir]

I don’t see how we could even laughably say that the winner of the NLEast is not the worst of the playoff teams. The distance between our division and the top of the other division is pretty large.

By "the other division" I assume you mean the West, but we don't have to worry about them until the NLCS. Would we likely lose that series? Sure. Would it be hard to beat the Brewers? Maybe. But a team with Buxton, Berrios and (let's just say) Kimbrel would not be the current team (though of course the other teams will be upgrading too).

Obviously this is a fantasy deal that likely isn't happening, nor is bundling them necessarily the best move for the Twins. But if the Phillies only get rentals this year they will be paying a lot more to fill the CF (or LF) and 4th (or 3rd) starter hole next year anyway.

[bkox]

Twins have started dealing:

BREAKING: The Tampa Bay Rays are finalizing a deal to acquire slugger Nelson Cruz from the Minnesota Twins, sources tell ESPN.

— Jeff Passan ( @JeffPassan ) July 22, 2021

[Taudawg]

If the players the Twins receive in return are major league ready or close, they are probably retooling for 2022 push. I would think Buxton would be off limits in that scenario.

[bkox]

#MNTwins complete trade with Tampa Bay Rays.

Club acquires right-handed minor league pitchers Joe Ryan and Drew Strotman, in exchange for designated hitter Nelson Cruz and right-handed minor league pitcher Calvin Faucher.

— Minnesota Twins ( @Twins ) July 22, 2021

Rays #10 and #17 prospects according to MLB pipeline

[zambonir]

I do wonder what the final data point will be for the team in terms of trading. Prior to tonight's (likely) loss our playoff odds were already back down below the Mets (albeit just slightly). Do they need to see 5 or 6 wins over these next 8 or is another bump in the road just all the more reason to get better? And what does being in a three or even four-team race do to their thinking.

Certainly a team with another starter and reliever (and Bohm for that matter) probably wins 1 or 2 of these games.

[allentown]

We are starting to trend down again. We are still a .500 or slightly below team.

[flyers19rw]

Just my opinion but IMO, this club’s aggregate is not equal to the sum of its parts. There are more than enough quality players here to be several games over .500. They just don’t click as a unit. The reaction of the players to the need for vaccinations illustrates this. Too many players interested in themselves. When it’s that way off of the field, it will show up on it.

[bkox]

The #Yankees have been involved in talks to acquire star shortstop Trevor Story from the Colorado #Rockies . Colorado has asked for OF Clint Frazier and no. 11 and 12 prospects Anthony Volpe and Kevin Alcantara in return for the 3 time All-Star shortstop.

— Michael Hawk ( @mlbhawk ) July 22, 2021

[zambonir]

In a lot of ways the vaccination issue is ownership's out. But I don't think they can bear the thought of not doing something, and at least trying to have meaningful baseball in September (after failing at that for three straight years).

If you're Middleton and Dombrowski and you decide to stand pat or sell, how do you evaluate the season? Middleton wanted JT back no matter what and because of that Dombrowski convinced him the team needed to spend more money... though not enough. Nearly all of of his signings were bad to mediocre (besides JT). They put a lot of expectation into Kingery, Haseley, Howard and now even Nola that went unfufilled. And the manager has been undistinguished at best (which might be kind).

My impression is these are not men who like to own their mistakes, of which there have been many (by Middleton at least).

[Philsmania]

My impression is these are not men who like to own their mistakes, of which there have been many (by Middleton at least).

Middleton's mistake was hiring the wrong people. Like it or not, blowing it all up and starting over again is probably the only way to go.

Dombrowski made a good move in signing Miller and Bradley appears to be coming around. But the rest of his pitching moves (Anderson, Moore and Kintzler) are a $13 million sunk cost.

[Philsmania]

Just my opinion but IMO, this club’s aggregate is not equal to the sum of its parts. There are more than enough quality players here to be several games over .500. They just don’t click as a unit. The reaction of the players to the need for vaccinations illustrates this. Too many players interested in themselves. When it’s that way off of the field, it will show up on it.

This team needs a change in culture. Changing the manager didn't change it. Need to change the clubhouse or find a true leader. Harper and Realmuto are the strong, quiet "lead by example" types but that only goes so far. This team badly needs a Daulton, a Rollins or an Utley or, even though they are not terribly popular around here, a Bowa or a Rose on the roster.

[zambonir]

His worst move might have been Didi. Certainly not malpractice at the time, and nobody could have known he would be so poor at the plate, but the defense has been terrible, and if he'd signed Galvis he could have done better than Bradley (or bought another reliever or OF in addition).

With the payroll the team has, "just go .500 and see what you need at the deadline" is probably not supposed to be the plan, but it's also not a bad plan. I'm sure Dombrowski didn't expect all his pitchers to work out (including Vince) but things would have been a lot better if one of them had.

This team needs a change in culture. Changing the manager didn't change it. Need to change the clubhouse or find a true leader.

That's what Cutch and Didi were supposed to be. Right now I'd say the problem is the team has some strong leaders, they are just leading the team in a bad direction.

[Philsmania]

Most fans were in favor of resigning Didi. Maybe he'll have a good season next year like Segura this year.

[bkox]

The Twins seek a prospect-big leaguer combo back for Berrios described as a “shoot the moon” ask. They may lower the request as the deadline approaches but now rivals doubt he will be traded. Twins people like their nucleus and are telling folks they don’t want to “punt” on 2022.

— Jon Heyman ( @JonHeyman ) July 23, 2021

[zambonir]

But will Segura be good next year?

I'm just not sure you can play Didi at SS. But you might not have to.

[flyers19rw]

Not saying that they’re bad guys but today during a pause in the action with Acuna on 2B, Didi and Segura are there joking around with him. I can’t see JRoll and Utley doing that. Winners compete 3X9X27. There’s a time to socialize and there’s a time to bear down and put/keep your head in the game.

[zambonir]

Well, it couldn't have been Acuña.

I think that ship has sailed, much like the debate over how to behave when you hit a HR, and I bet if you went back and watched video J-Roll and Utley did it too. Guys are always talking, at 1B especially.

[bkox]

I think baseball has changed. Freeman is down there talking all the time to everyone. Hoskins was miked up for ESPN during a game and was talking to players. All around baseball players laugh and joke with the opponents.

[zambonir]

Yes, the problem is our players aren't good enough, not that they aren't competitive or focused. I would certainly take Freeman on my team. I certainly wouldn't keep Freeman off my roster!

[Sabin]

With the payroll the team has, "just go .500 and see what you need at the deadline" is probably not supposed to be the plan, but it's also not a bad plan.

Well, I don't know about that. I don't think you choose to spend that much money - fifth-highest payroll in the league - and plan to struggle to hit .500 and the league median in win % (currently 17th). You place yourself in a position of need at the deadline, and given your minors are relatively bereft of talent and your payroll is hugging the CBT threshold, whatever price you have to pay will be at a premium to fill the needs you have.

I wouldn't consider that a good plan.