Phillies 2021 Spring Training Discussion

[Florida_Sunshine]

Derek Fisher was the player.

[julio]

speaking of that trade, CD, what ever happened to that kid you would have liked included in that trade? Instead of Appel, this kid was an OF (Fisher?) Didi he ever make it?
gm

That was Derek Fisher. Total ML WAR to date: 0.0. In other words, a complete wash vs. Appel. Fisher got some ML playing time, but produced...literally, nothing.

Derek Fisher Stats | Baseball-Reference.com

[Philsmania]

Fisher had a huge season in 2017 for the Astros' AAA team and made it to Houston that season, showed some promise there and, for a while, looked like something the Phillies really missed out on. But, since then, his AAA success never translated to the Big Leagues.

It's entirely possible that Jonathan Arauz ends up being the one who got away in that deal.

[gmwannabe]

That's him. Thanks. looks like Appel could work out better in the end. Here's hoping Dreamline pushed him higher.
gm

[Taudawg]

I believe Mark Appel was on the 40 man roster when he left/retired. Will the Phillies need to make a 40 man space when he officially returns?

[zambonir]

Fisher did all right in his cup of coffee last year but he's looking like a Nick Williams.

None of it changes anything really. Process/value on paper vs. outcome/value in reality. The Phillies weren't necessarily wrong to think that changing the deal to get Appel was better for them, and CD also isn't necessarily wrong to think Fisher could have been great even though he isn't. The Aurauz part would be the most ironic thing, since that was kind of the sweetener the Phillies put in in order to take the Appel sweetener.

Also bears remembering that the Phillies supposedly did all that after claiming there were red flags in VV's medical report. It was presented as, "Velasquez is a bit higher-risk than we'd like, so give us another pitcher." And you can't say Vince didn't have his health issues - it slowed him down in two different seasons. Just not any major ones.

No, Appel was DFA'ed and cleared waivers before he retired. That was kind of the precipitating incident for it.

[andyb]

Watching today I still think the Phillies might be deciding between Haseley and Herrera for the last outfield spot. There really is not a great reason to keep 6 outfielders. Cutch and Harper and Joyce are givens. Quinn seems likely at this point too. That is why I would not dismiss Chatham or Maton coming back for the last bench spot.

Right now in the bullpen you have Neris, Bradley, and Alvarado at the back end. Kintzler, Brogdon, Hale, Velasquez, and Coonrod are the others. I guess a 9th would be off roster for the moment (Feliz or Mitchell) so that is unlikely.

That means, assuming everyone including Miller is healthy, the battle for the 24th and 25th roster spots are between Quinn, Haseley, Herrera, and Chatham/Maton. Two of the four will make it. Another factor for another middle infielder is Miller's ability to play defense at the moment. Clearly Segura is the backup SS, but is Miller even ready to play 2B or 3B?

[zambonir]

Torreyes has indeed made the team.

[LoneStarPhan]

So it is now looking like they must clear three or maybe four spots on the 40 man roster. They must add to the 40 man roster:

1. Kintzler
2. Joyce
3. Torreyes
   and maybe
4. Herrera

I would think that this is a factor against Herrera making the initial active roster. I am sure there are players on the current 40 that are not great prospects, but I hate to see them lose talent. I am sure they have explored possible trades and there are probably some who cam be put on waivers for outrighting to the minors that will go unclaimed and thus under control for the rest of this season.

[andyb]

Well that seems a waste since he is only marginally better than Chatham or Maton on defense and nowhere near what they are on offense. Could be a sign that Herrera will not make it because of the 40-man spot (losing out to Haseley).

[zambonir]

Yup, but he's been ahead of them all spring - at least since they were paper-moved back to mini-camp - and is obviously a Girardi favorite.

One assumes they have this Muzziotti loophole in play for a while, if they feel they can that easily replace Kingery with someone who isn't on the 40. But yes it would also seem to be a strike against Herrera who is still redundant as anything other than the clear starter.

[andyb]

If Mulliotti had "COVID" and takes most of April to get healthy it would put him right in line to start opening day for Reading.

[zambonir]

Did he ever actually report? Were there visa issues as well?

Going on the list for COVID reasons is certainly an open-ended loophole, easy enough to claim lingering symptoms.

I'll say this about Torreyes, for as long as I've been following the Phillies as an adult I can't recall a manager (and by implication a GM) who didn't love his light-hitting utility guy.

Torreyes also started more games in CF for the Phillies last year than Herrera.

[andyb]

Well, Eric Bruntlett was clearly the difference in 2008 so who is there to doubt Girardi. Just don't like that it will cost us someone like Christopher Sanchez to have him on the roster for what I imagine might be a short period of time.

[baseballoldie]

Phillies release Chatham to open up the spot for Torreyes

[zambonir]

Well there ya go, that's a pretty simple/easy switch. Especially if Kingery can't win a starting job in 2022. Still got Maton, and it's also not that hard to find another Gosselin/Torreyes etc. in future years.

[baseballoldie]

Surprised it was a release for Chatham instead of a DFA. Guess they didn’t see a fit for him in the organization nor an opportunity to trade him.

[zambonir]

Yeah, probably no trade value. Might have just been doing him a solid to see if he could get on with another team, especially if the DFA process left him stranded in Clearwater rather than joining the higher-level minor leaguers. And the alternate site roster is still capped, and drawing from players at multiple levels, with limited opportunities for playing time each week. In a normal year he probably fits onto the Iron Pigs roster if he clears.

[andyb]

A little surprised by the release. Might be as much about Kingery as anything else. Kingery needs to play and most of us suspected Maton was a better prospect than Chatham so needs to play also. And of course middle infield reserves are pretty easy to come by.

[Taudawg]

I doubt they would do so, but Kingery could be designated and I don't think another team would make a claim. Too much contract left for someone to roll the dice.