The New Unending Flyers thread

[flyers19rw]

Every year one club or another has issues with players who don't like the way that they're being treated and, for a variety of reasons, cause a dust up with management. Columbus traded Laine away to Montreal yesterday because he refused to play for them any more. Nashville has Askarov who is demanding a trade to get out of that organization. On and on the list goes. Wait for a few weeks there probably will be a few more.

[zambonir]

Yeah I would agree we just don't pay that much attention to other clubs. Even the Gauthier situation, Adam Fox did the same thing and barely anyone remembers that now.

As a fan I don't blame any player for using whatever they legally can to control their own destiny within the employment monopoly. But also, like VFK, want my team to be someone guys want to play for.

[flyers19rw]

For decades the Flyers were seen as a premier destination for players. Some of that might have evaporated due to the Clarke-Lindros feud. Still Ed Snider treated guys quite well following that dust up. Now it's a different era with Comcast in control. Yet they've done well by most of their players. Couturier and Farabee have been treated decently coming off of serious injuries. The current FO does not have a reputation for being unreasonable. I can't see why a player wouldn't want to be a Flyer which is why the Gauthier thing made no sense. There has to be more to that than we know.

[Austinfan]

Gauthier is from Arizona, engineers a trade to Anaheim.
May simply be after a couple years in Boston, decided he wanted to return to the West Coast.

[zambonir]

Gauthier's drift from the Flyers started when it was still a floundering organization. By the time they hired Jones it was too late. And, while they seem to be doing a good job so far, the Jones and Briere hire didn't really give his camp any reason to think revolutionary change was coming. Then there was also the question of him wanting to come to the NHL a year sooner. And the Kevin Hayes thing (not that he necessarily dissed the Flyers and Torts - or so he says - but he himself refused to sign with the team that drafted him and may have simply been supportive).

But also let's not kid ourselves: it was not the Flyers' storied history or Mr. Snider that made the team a destination. It was the payroll in am uncapped league. And winning

[zambonir]

Never a dull moment

Flyers' Johansen on waivers for contract breach

It’s expected that Johansen will file a grievance via the NHL Players’ Association, although he has 60 days to decide. Johansen is represented by Kurt Overhardt, who also represents former Flyers prospect Cutter Gauthier, who was traded in January. A request for comment from Overhardt was not immediately returned.

[VoteForKalas]

Wouldn't that be Colorado's obligation to disclose any injury before consummation of the trade or is it totally a buyer beware situation i.e. the Flyers responsibility?

I think the Flyers should do whatever possible to get his salary off their books, but if he files a grievance it can get messy. One wonders what type, if any, of medical checks the Flyers did on him as part of or after the trade.

[zambonir]

The argument is Johansen was healthy - he played in the Avs last game before the trade - and was lying, or perhaps failed to disclose. If the Avs traded the Flyers a broken player it ought to have been voidable. No indication the Flyers ever even wanted to file a grievance against Colorado.

Seems like they were either expecting him to play or accept the buyout or both. But by claiming injury he can't be bought out.

Of course he also can't play .

[Docs]

In both cases it seems like the players are trying to have their cake and eat it too. It appears that the flyers are accusing Johnson of faking an injury so that he didn’t have to accept his AHL assignment, which would otherwise be grounds to terminate the contract. The Flyers benefit in some cap space if he accepts the assignment. If the player wants the remaining salary, they have to accept the assignment like Andrew Macdonald and Cal Peterson did. Flyers will not take issue with Colorado because they want the draft pick.

In Kolosov’s case it feels like he came over in the spring to advance the years on his ELC. If he wants to stay in the KHL i would do exactly what the Flyers are doing and freeze the clock. If he is loaned, he will have worked 2 years off of his ELC service time for one months play, accelerating his path the UFA.

[Aquapong]

Material breach sounds like a Ben Rothlisberger thing when people were ticked when he drove a motorcycle and got in an accident despite it being his contract that he wasn't supposed to be riding motorcycles. Now cutting the star Qb isn’t going to happen, but maybe the Flyers caught Johansson doing something he wasn’t supposed to in his contract. A former coworker of mine was a catching prospect with the Yankees. He said his contract forbade pretty much anything other than doing team activities and going home.

I think it might set a crappy precedent though unless they caught him doing something really bad.

[Docs]

I was also thinking maybe they caught him doing something he wouldn’t be able to do if he was injured

[zambonir]

It does sound like that but it's not that. Clearly it is simply that he refused to honor his contract by playing for the Phantoms, and the point of contention remains whether he was injured or not. They put him on waivers, they assigned him to the Phantoms, he refused to report, saying he was injured. And by still being injured at the end of the season it also meant he couldn't be bought out. It also sounds like he didn't show up, period - no medical treatment or workouts or rehab, in Allentown or Philly.

The assumption is also that he didn't want to play for Torts - they have a history - had the Flyers actually had occasion to call him up.

If the Flyers are in the right, it's pretty straighforward, and he's the one trying to game the system.

What makes it extra spicy is it's not just going to cost Johansen $4 million. It would cost him $8 million because he'd lose the part that Nashville was already paying too.

[zambonir]

That'd be a fun twist. But I suspect they've known this was going to be their avenue all along.

I suppose the other possible counter-move Johansen could make is to say he's recovered from the injury and ready to report.

[bkeich]

I went back and looked at the articles on the trade, they said what I thought I remembered, that the Flyers tried to put him on waivers minutes after acquiring him.

Assuming he gets paid either way, what is the basis of the grievance. Does it effect him financially?

[zambonir]

They succeeded in putting him on waivers, and he cleared, he just didn't report to the AHL.

And no. He gets no money whatsoever if the Flyers succeed in terminating his contract. Including the money Nashville would be paying (50% of it). So yeah, he'd fight it!

So the only common-sense argument in his favor is, why would this guy refuse to play in the AHL for $8 million, especially when there might be an opportunity in the NHL or to get traded again (albeit with a coach he hates)? If the Flyers are right, he's trying to get paid $8 million to sit at home. If they're wrong, they have to pay him or put him on LTIR (which has its own downside). It's not like they really wanted him, that was just part of the deal to take the salary off Colorado's hands to improve the return on Walker.

I guess it could just be a pride and ego thing if it's not Torts. He didn't like being a throw-in for the deal, and didn't want to play in the AHL (just like Kolosov - those hotels and bus rides aren't very fun even if you're North American).

[bkeich]

Thanks for the info, yea, I misread it as waivers / release not termination. Long day, comprehension a little low.

[zambonir]

According to the Inquirer, Johansen did come to Philly for an exam last March. But after that, nothing. The language in the contract is:

The Club may also terminate this SPC upon written notice to the Player (but only after obtaining Waivers from all other Clubs) if the Player shall at any time:

(a) fail, refuse, or neglect to obey the Club’s rules governing training and conduct of Players, if such failure, refusal or neglect should constitute a material breach of this SPC.

b) fail, refuse or neglect to render his services hereunder or in any other manner materially breach this SPC.

I don't think we can entirely rule out that this is a pissing contest between the Flyers and Gauthier/Johansen's agent. Seems more like Clark/Holmgren behavior, but hey, they aren't actually gone, and the agent may not be any more mature.

[zambonir]

Whoa. Awful. Johnny Gaudreau and his brother.

2 bicyclists struck, killed after by vehicle in Salem County, New Jersey

https://www.dispatch.com/story/sports/nhl/columbus-blue-jackets/20g24/08/30/columbus-blue-jackets-johnny-gaudreau-dead-bike-accident-crashnew-jersey-calgary-flamesnhl/75009208007/

[Docs]

That’s so sad. The report says the accident occurred around 830pm. They were in town for their sister’s wedding.

[Squire]

Not that it matters much but this report says the driver did NOT flee the scene

2 bicyclists struck, killed after by vehicle in Salem County, New Jersey