Phillies Hot Stove, Winter 2023-24

[andyb]

I'd like them to seriously look at bringing some of the ones who got away - Jankowski to replace Cave - then you have great defense, speed with a better bat on the bench

Not sure the fit. We'll be carrying 2 good defensive OFs already. Marsh and at least one of Pache or Rojas on the roster now. Only room for 4 OF plus Schwarber. Castellanos and then one left-handed bat that can hit. Could be Harper. Could be a bat better than either Cave or Jankowski. Marsh just eliminated the need for a Jankowski type on the roster because he does everything better.

[zambonir]

With Pache, Marsh and Rojas they don't need a Jankowski type (even if Rojas starts in AAA). Cave's problem was his bat, not that he was a merely competent defender. And Jankowski doesn't have one of those, despite making noise for one World Series game. One would hope Texas brings him back but otherwise he's probably looking at a minor league deal.

Neris may or may not become a free agent. If you had to choose between Neris and Kimbrel who would you pick? Neris might be better, but both probably aren't worth the second go-around. The biggest problem with both of them is not that they were bad but that the fan base is scarred by the times they have struggled. Some already feel that way about Seranthony (and to a lesser extent Alvarado) too.

[Aquapong]

There are several RH OF FA bats out there. Make some offers and see who bites.

Resigning Nola is likely the safest course of action. He’s going to get paid, but nothing obscene hopefully.

Kiki Hernandez could be a nice jack of all trades signing, getting his starts by spelling guys all over the diamond.

Churn the bottom of the roster and the 40 man (Sosa, Cave, and Stubbs) and that would likely be my off season.

[bkox]

As expected, the Phillies declined INF Scott Kingery’s $13 million club option for the 2024 season. They took a $1 million buyout instead.

— Todd Zolecki ( @ToddZolecki ) November 3, 2023

‘𝐏𝐢𝐠𝐬 𝐭𝐨 ‘𝐁𝐢𝐠𝐬 ️

Congratulations to IronPigs Pitching Coach Cesar Ramos for being named the @Phillies Bullpen Coach! #YourHometownTeam pic.twitter.com/MJq4ZuuI4e

— Lehigh Valley IronPigs ( @IronPigs ) November 3, 2023

[zambonir]

So where do we put Scott Kingery on the list of failed Phillies hopefuls (never mind whose fault it was)? I guess just in recent history/this century he joins Dom Brown and Cody Asche and Haseley... with Brown being the closest in terms of how high expectations got.

Even Franco arguably had a better/longer showing, while Moniak never reallly raised our expectations.

[BostonRoss]

Michael Taylor, though he was traded before reaching the majors. He was a bust.

[zambonir]

Yeah Taylor busted w/o ever teasing us really, even for his new team right? I'd put him more in the Dylan Cozens category (but at least Cozens played a little). And then there are the Kelly Dugans and Reggie Taylors who never really became prospects at all.

I guess this isn't actually that hard to quantify, based on both draft position and highest prospect ranking. Brown was a 5th-rounder but was BA's top prospect in all of baseball at one point. Haseley was a high first-round pick but never a Top 50 prospect I don't think. Kingery was a second-rounder who made it to #31 BA (and the best 2B prospect in baseball, oops). The contract adds a little - a lot - to the precipitousness of his fall but Brown still takes it I think.

Franco was very much a top prospect and can't really call him a bust, just a disappointment.

Maikel Franco's Monstrous Spring Signals MLB's Next Big Hitting Star Has Arrived

[bkeich]

Franco to me is a hard one to define. He could hit, he wasn’t a bad offensive player, just not a good one either. Add in his questionable defense and he just wasn’t a starter.

In years past he might have excelled in the 3B / 1B / PH bench position. That position is now gone

[zambonir]

I mean I don't think it's that hard to define. He was expected to either be a good enough hitter to stay at 3B or an even better hitter who could move to 1B. Those expectations may have been lofty, but they existed at the time. In that sense he was a bust. But as a guy who actually got as far as he did (including making the majors in the first place) and had a credible, if ordinary, major league career (and the accompanying benefits), a success.

Still not convinced Bohm will end his time in Philadelphia looking that much better, but he's a bit of a folk hero who also enjoys being on good teams that don't need him to be one of the four best hitters. They needed Franco to be one of the two best a few of those years.

[bkox]

Shockingly, Franco ranks 25th all time in HRs in a Phillies uniform

[julio]

I mean I don't think it's that hard to define. He was expected by delusional fans to either be a good enough hitter to stay at 3B or an even better hitter who could move to 1B. Those expectations may have been lofty, but they existed at the time.

Fixed it for you, z?

[bkox]

Anyone want to bring Hector back? I wouldnt mind giving him the $10M Kimbrel got this year.

OPTION: #Astros RHP Hector Neris has declined his player option for the 2024 season. He'll receive a $1M buyout.

— MLB Transaction Tracker ( @MLBMovesTracker ) November 4, 2023

[zambonir]

Yeah but would you give him $12 million? Or 2/20? Because he just turned down $8.5 (well, 7.5 since got a buyout. But he's obviously eyeing a bigger or longer deal). And that was a bargain deal for Kimbrel, if he'd actually been good last year he would have done better (and apparently will this year).

Wink aside, julio, I'm not sure expectations for Maikel were delusional, unlike, say, the people who thought Asche could be another Utley. Of course in both cases they were also skewed by the fact that there were so few prospects in the system, period.

I did not even try to include Roman Quinn in this!

[bkox]

Yeah.. Maikel was ranked very high by the people who do it for a living

And that was honestly all from one good year in the minors when he hit .320 31HR 103 RBI and 926OPS in 2013 over 2 levels.

But I remember it was Keith Law who kept warning us that he had some kinda hitch in his swing (want to say it was called an arm bar) and that he would struggle in the MLB.

BTW.. Franco is still active. He played in Japan this year but struggled badly. 644 OPS.

[zambonir]

It's hard to believe Franco and Bryce Harper were actually teammates (though I also remember how Maikel got off to a hot start in that offense).

[bkox]

Zack Wheeler wins a gold glove. No other Phillie wins

[phillychuck]

And Wheeler is not the best fielding pitcher on his own team...GG awards are complete crap. Bobby Abreu won one, and as much as I love him as a player, fielding was not his strength.

[andyb]

The awards are better now that there are widely distributed advanced analytics. Ranger fell short of the innings limit the second time in a row. Maybe that limit is too high, but remember when fielders would win with like 30-40 games played?

Wheeler deserves it if controlling the running game is considered part of fielding on the mound.

[zambonir]

Not sure I entirely understand how this would work, other than, obviously, the Phillies would presumably rather not increase Harper's AAV, so they could give him money on the back end that he may or may not ever earn (even if he says he'd like to play until he's 45). I guess you could work a bonus in there somehow too.

Bryce Harper’s camp continues to hint at desire for contract extension with...

[allentown]

Why? He already has an overly long contract at huge $. He's not underpaid. He's hitting the point where decline is to be expected. And yes, I realize that his contract has been a plus -- for now, but soon it will not be. While Harper will certainly be able to cash a check at the age 45 he mentions, he certainly won't be able to play baseball. I don't want the Phillies to be paying Harper's AAV farther into the future. I don't want him beyond the term of his current deal, very likely not that long.