It has been a bad week for this thread. John Amos was always one of my favorites. I know that Good Times was ground breaking, but he really hated what it became when they focused on making JJ into a clown and pandering to stereotypes. He was a very good tough guy actor and I always loved his character in that show.
RIP
I think we are reading into much into Schmidt’s statement, it reads to me as what you say when a respected teammate dies, and while some didn’t respect Rose, Schmidt has always been clear about his feelings. I guarantee there are a lot of Rose teammates and even opponents that respected him, his failings after his career were bad at times, but I am sure he has guys from every team who just choose to remember his playing days.
Schmidt is not over-analyzing his statement like we are. He lost a guy he considered a friend and a guy he learned from. Maybe he isn’t as great at putting those feelings to paper.
Rose had his flaws, but trust me, every one of us enjoyed watching him at times with the Phillies. He was an infectious player.
I apologize. I was specifically referring to the Phillies statement and not Schmidt's. But honestly, I can't help but think that at least acknowledging Rose was a controversial figure would have been appropriate.
Ahh, I know what you mean, but not on the day he passes away. To me you don’t acknowledge someone’s faults the day they die. Another day.
Just my opinion, you are right, he had his faults, I still think he shouldn’t be in the HOF, but to me there is just no reason to bring the stuff up when he can no longer defend himself and no longer change. RIP
Interesting. Because I think he does belong in the HOF now that he has passed but I also think just because you're dead doesn't mean you shouldn't acknowledge someone's faults. We're all human. Baseball is just a game and what you do outside of it matters.
"The Phillies are saddened to learn of Pete Rose's passing. Despite some of his controversies, Rose will always be remembered for his grit and hustle, ..."
I don't see how something like that is not appropriate here.
Yeah I'm very much of the school that you talk about it all when someone dies. The first paragraph of Joe Paterno's NY Times obit is a good example in my book.
Joe Paterno, who won more games than any other major-college football coach, and who became the face of Pennsylvania State University and a symbol of integrity in collegiate athletics only to be fired during the 2011 season amid a child sexual abuse scandal that reverberated throughout the nation, died Sunday in State College, Pa. He was 85.
To me Pete was already a HOFer; not sure how him being dead changes it (though it would be an ironic and even spiteful thing to do it now that he can't enjoy it). But he can't be voted in without either MLB or the Hall changing their policy (just like with Shoeless Joe). Technically, the debate over whether he should or shouldn't be voted in has never happened.
An obituary is technically a news story, and as such should report the facts. A public statement is a statement of condolences and often is read by the family of the deceased. Pointing out the faults of their loved one when they have just started the grieving process seems coldhearted to me in a statement where condolences are being expressed.
Yes a fair point. A team statement is a press release. Those are often not even truthful, let alone blunt/honest. But I read BK's post as arguing more that none of us should speak ill of the dead when they first pass. Which people certainly do believe. Unfortunately with someone like Pete there's not much good you can say other than, great ballplayer.
RIP. I have a selfie with him at Fenway Park in 2017.
I think he's a Hall of Famer. JAWS has him as the 44th best starting pitcher (he's 45th in WAR); there are over 60 in the HOF. Would have won the Cy Young Award in 1968 if McLain hadn't won 30. His ERA was 1.60 that year, one of two years he was under 2.00. He started all three games the Red Sox won in the 1975 World Series, two complete games and one that went 12 innings (the famous Game 6). He also threw a complete game win with zero ER in the ALCS.
And former Phillie, he pitched briefly for the Phillies in 1994. I remember vividly the Phillies being the first team to beat him after he started his career with something like 14 straight wins. Schmidt took him deep and Bystrom and Reed blanked the Dodgers and the Phillies won 4-0.
