Coronavirus (Sports-Related and General)

[BostonRoss]

I think the benefit to society of a person wearing a mask is much greater than the benefit to that person. The probability of a mask stopping the droplets from an infected person reaching others is probably high if he or she is wearing a mask, since the droplets come from the covered area. The mask protects the wearer only if droplets from an infected person hit the mask. Most people aren’t likely to have the nose/mouth of an infected person close enough to their own faces for that to happen. And the mask doesn’t prevent the wearer from getting the virus through its reaching another body part that the wearer touches before touching his or her face, or from touching a surface that has been contaminated by an infected person who wasn’t wearing a mask.

The real benefit of requiring masks is to prevent infected people from expelling droplets as much as possible.

[Lawman]

Part of opening up is having a plan in place for isolated shutdowns so that if you need to close any part of a geographic area you can do so. If you plan on opening up say, a day camp, you also better be able to have a plan to keep bunks isolated from each other so if one kid gets the virus you don't shut the whole camp down, just that bunk. Same for schools for next year. Part of opening up is having plans in place to close down if need be.

[LegoDoom]

Everything a person emits is not that small. Even if it was, the mask of the wearer blocks a lot of the bigger droplets and some of the small ones. The same goes for the person wearing the mask that is not infected.

A bigger droplet can also be reduce in size while in the air. If that bigger droplet is stopped from reaching circulated air, then that chance is reduced.

But go ahead and don't wear a mask because.... minor inconvenience?

EDIT: to add that a mask also reduces droplets that land on surfaces and the virus can be transmitted by contact that way.

[julio]

But go ahead and don't wear a mask because.... minor inconvenience?

But the key point is that masks worn by those who are contagious - whether they's symptomatic or not - reduce the risk of infecting others.

So, if you're certain that you are not contagious - for instance, if you have been isolated from all exposure for 14 days or more - you can skip the mask and not technically risk exposing somebody else. Even then, your lack of a mask will suggest to others that you don't care about their health, and will encourage others - who may be contagious - to skip the mask.

In sum, choosing to not wear a mask is just simply selfish. Yeah, they're inconvenient. My glasses tend to fog up. But the mask makes a difference.

So, if you don't wear a mask, lots of people will make certain assumptions about you: 1) You don't care about their health; 2) you're selfish; 3) you're probably a libertarian or a "conservative" - which in America today tends to mean you're basically selfish.

[zambonir]

Somehow I made it all the way up until now without learning that some people think you can get "C02 poisoning" from wearing masks. Oy vey.

Obviously there is discomfort. I get not wanting to exercise with them. And it certainly would be unpleasant to wear one at your job for 8 hours day - but that's why it's all the more selfish and insulting for people to claim they shouldn't have to wear one at businesses where the employees do so.

Alas, I suspect the people who are most loudly refusing to wear the masks are also refusing to participate in other mitigation, so vicious cycle.

And if you're symptomless but were in 14-day quarantine, that still only lasts until the first day you go somewhere/do something, mask or no mask. Even then 14 days is not a magic number and neither is six feet.

What I find unfortunate is that even our lockdown to this point has been inadequate (even more so now) and in the long run that is going to lead to more pain (economic as well as mortal). We were never gonna be New Zealand, but if we'd been better prepared and taken it all more seriously, we'd have a better shot at "normal." That's always been the problem with the economic argument for opening. It's gonna be worse for everyone if there's a spike and second closing (and even worse if there's a spike and no closing), and the people who will suffer in all cases aren't (for the most part) posting on this board - it will be the service, agricultural and manufacturing workers.

[julio]

Somehow I made it all the way up until now without learning that some people think you can get "C02 poisoning" from wearing masks. Oy vey.

I missed this one, too! I have to keep reminding myself that, given the level of knowledge of science (and of everything) in the American public, there's pretty much no bit of nonsensical rubbish that won't have some "believers."

As I've said many times, we don't educate very well... and even more fundamentally, a large segment of our society (and our culture) literally mocks and belittles education, in favor of "feelings," "intuition," or "I still believe..." The rest of us have to continually drag these people along. They love their TVs, they love their cell phones; but if all of us shared their attitudes toward real knowledge - science, facts, reason - instead of superstitious nonsense, these people would be living in caves eating raw roots and the occasional dead squirrel.

[California_Dreamin]

I used to watch a show called Dragnet and Sergent Joe Friday was famous for telling all witnesses, "just the facts, maam." So here are the facts, again based on the numbers given out by the John Hopkins Worldometer site, the one most recognized by all concerned as being the most accurate. I will present the numbers without commentary [I will save those fir the end]...5,302, 6,014, 6,583, 8,252, 9,729, 12,587, 12,640, 13,453, 13,911 [the week of April 18 when most virologists said we were entering our potential worst two weeks, appears they were correct], 12,243 [week of April 11.]

With the initial admission that all of these deaths are a tragedy [especially the needless ones from the nursing homes debacle] these are the weekly death totals since April 11 and if see a pattern you should, they are going down weekly. In fact the week of June 7-13 saw the first week of an entire week without 1000 deaths a day. and yesterday's 695 was one of the smallest since the crisis started.

And here are perhaps even more important numbers for the United States...4.56, 4.77, 5.31, 5.68, 6.70, 8.72, 12.43, 14.12, 19.54, 20.81 [again these were during that terrible two weeks when we were being told daily that things were about to get bad]. These numbers indicate the nation wide percentage positive test results per 100 tests administered. Again, trending completely downward, without even a weekly blip.

As I said yesterday, I am open to acknowledging a change for the worse should it occur and I do recognize that certain states seem to be trending the wrong way and need to stay on top of this. I get it, I am no PollyAnna here. But to continually hear and read everywhere that things are getting worse, a second wave is coming, prepare for another lockdown and even worse...we can't open up yet is belied for the facts that too few people are getting. I will let you decide for yourself why that is occurring, my belief system based on the states that are doing this are fairly clear.

Still, I believe many on this site who don't post for fear of reprisal by some of the most articulate and skilled posters I have ever read [ a huge compliment] need to hear the good news, the optimistic news, the real news. Those numbers are real, they are up to date and they come from the site that we have been religiously relying since late March. If they are wrong, then shame on all the experts who have kept us housebound all these months.

Now, my commentary. The dismissal of the numbers I gave yesterday [today they are even better, a +600,000 recovered vs still active cases] seems very strange to me....how can it not be good and positive news that the recovery rate is now far outdistancing the still active numbers, especially given that the death rates world wide are decreasing. This is fantastic news and seems to indicate to me that more people are getting better than are still sick and that more people are getting better vs the number of new people getting sick. A few weeks ago the number was in the negative and it has turned not only positive quickly, but is skyrocketing lately [ a week ago it was +50,000.]

I attribute this to better medication techniques, better knowledge of the virus,and a continuing downward spiral in cases involving serious medical care. Of course, there are red flags world wide...Mexico, Brazil, Russia, Iran but I suspect they have as much to do with lack of solid medical care as it does an increase in the potency of the virus.

Look, perhaps I a wrong and this all blows up in my face. Maybe. But as long as the news continues in a positive direction I am going to present it as honestly as I can and if it alleviates the fears of even a few people on this site then it will have been worth it.

Its time to go back outside and enjoy the summer breezes.

[schillingfan]

The number that matters to me most is hospitalizations. That’s not a factor (much) of testing, it’s an indication of spread and seriousness and overload of hospitals. It looks like we are getting better at treatment, which naturally occurs as we get more data and information. That means less deaths.

But we don’t want the disease to spread, right? Because people will still die and stress our hospitals. So if we can reduce the spread by wearing masks and avoiding very risky activities, we should had a will to do so, for the sake of the vulnererablr.

[andyb]

Tests will trend downward when more tests of healthy non-symptomatic people are done. There is a small overall downward trend in the virus though there is a stubborn increase in positive tests in the South where things have opened up more quickly. A non-scientific but logical view of what has happened would be:

• The warm weather has slowed the growth of the virus, especially as more people are outside
• At the same time the virus spread has increased as states have opened up

Both of these things can be true.

[xogfog]

I know how to avoid trouble and I'm not taking chances in big crowds and I don't touch my face and wash my hands at every opportunity. I wear a mask 99% for the benefit of other people and their feeling of safety.

[schillingfan]

CD, finally pondered your numbers. The stats don’t necessarily mean better. The statistics of positive tests rates going down can be more a reflection of number of tests being conducted. That’s a reflection of how many and who is tested. It’s not a random sample as only people with symptoms were tested, then it expanded to also first responders, and now anyone who feels they may have been exposed can get a test. The number of people being tested went up significantly, once tests became more widely available. As you test more people, the positive rate will go down, as you are testing a more random sample and not just those more likely to have Covid19.

Now, as to recoveries versus deaths, yes, that’s positive and reflective of our scientific and medical community learning more and treating, better and the wave of nursing homes being ravaged has decreased. As I said before I think increases or decreases in hospitalizations is the single best, if you are looking or data. Summer helps with more indoor activity versus more people congregating.

[California_Dreamin]

SF..thanks for the response and while I understand and agree that hospitalizations are important they are not more important or significant than the death totals. I'm not sure how anyone can dispute that. And as I mentioned before and its worth repeating because the states are acknowledging this [grudgingly in some cases, gee I wonder why?] and admitting that they are of course going to have an increase in hospitalizations now because they had emptied out the hospitals before in preparation for the wave of covid patients that for the most part never showed up, except for possibly in New York and New Jersey.

Now all those people who were told they could not come for elective surgeries then are returning and as a precaution EVERYONE who comes to the hospital is tested for COVID 19 and some of them test positive even though asymptomatic and never get sick. Yet they are COUNTED as Covid hospitalizations for the purpose of receiving federal money, money which they lost when they emptied the hospitals. One of the biggest crimes [and it is a crime!] that will someday come out of this entire episode is how federal officials refused to honestly share with the public all that was going on, and because of this public trust has been eroded almost completely.

So when its announced that hospitalizations are up for Covid they never separate the true Covid patients from the ones who came in for a cancer growth surgery and ended up being counted as a covid patient for accounting purposes.

No, my friend, the death totals are the most important indicator of where we are in this battle...they are the total runs allowed by a team, not walks, hits, errors, or hit by batters. They can tell you a trend but at the end of the day its runs allowed that matters most and in this game, the death total [runs allowed] is going down precipitously. In fact, unless there is a monster addition in the next hour [Worldometer turns over their numbers between 8:30-9 pm East Coast time] todays numbers, currently at 326, will be the lowest one day total since the true pandemic began in late March.

How anyone can not suggest this is very positive news seems so strange to me, almost as if one would prefer to dwell on the doomsday worst case scenarios that are unlikely to ever occur?

Oh, and one more thing worth mentioning...the fearmongers have been mentioning the ever higher cases in California, Arizona and Texas and indeed they are higher. I am always of the belief that if you dig deep enough you can find reasons for some anomaly to suddenly rear its ugly head out of the sand and I[along with all three states] think they have found it. What is the one thing all three things have in common and no, I don't mean professional baseball teams. Its called a Southern border and all 3 states border Mexico, a country that is rife with a Covid crisis right now.

What all three states are finding [probably through tracing, though common logic might suffice here] is that many are crossing the border daily, who either work in the states but live in Mexico or have dual citizenship and travel to and fro all the time. As someone who lives 90 miles from the border I can attest to the thousands who cross back and forth daily and the three states are convinced this is why the number of cases is rising. Of course, this being a sensitive and controversial subject the press is going to be loathe to discuss it. But its there nonetheless and my guess is that ultimately there will be testing done at the border coming and going.

Again, in the end we are all on the same side...we want this terrible virus to disappear. I want my baseball, football and basketball back. But I also want to present an accurate and what I believe is optimistic view of where we are and where I believe we are headed.

[California_Dreamin]

And the numbers are in for the day...5,000 less cases nation wide and the lowest death total since the pandemic started 2.5 months ago...326, probably a bit less than that since Veterans and Federal Prison deaths are often counted twice and there were 6 today. Down from 700 yesterday and 791 on Friday. World wide the death total dropped from 4600 on Friday, 4200 on Saturday and 3200 today, a drop of almost 33% in two days.

I won't do daily reports since they can fluctuate a bit and some states tend to under report one day and over report a few days later [New York and Michigan have been especially guilty of this] but my guess is that the main stream media will continue to try and scare people with second wave talk and higher than last week hospitalization numbers in random states [today its Arizona, tomorrow its Texas, Virginia has been quiet lately so they are a likely candidate after that] while ignoring one more HUGE bit of big news...almost everyone [left and right] agreed that if there was going to be a huge spike due to the protests Minnesota was going to be first since that was where they started.

After three weeks the results are in...no spike and in fact the numbers are a bit down. Seems to suggest that social distancing isn't as imperative as experts were saying. In fact, it seems more logical to me that it was the house bound lockdowns that might have contributed to higher numbers of cases...breathing the same air with the same people in oft times cramped conditions. Anyways, I will hold off on the social distancing theories for now because the evidence is still coming in and we may not truly know for a while.

What I do know is that the numbers [as of today] don't lie and the numbers are clearly headed in the right direction. I believe we haven't yet rounded the bases but I sure can see third base without wearing glasses!

[allentown]

At least in PA, don't know about other states, Sunday numbers are always low because people aren't at work and these cases end up being reported Monday-Tuesday. There is a weekly day-to-day rhythm, isuperimposed on the trend line.

[julio]

A second coronavirus wave appears underway in the U.S. And it’s just as unpredictable as the first https://t.co/JU8URayd41 — Bloomberg ( @business ) June 14, 2020

[bkox]

The Latest: China's capital re-institutes virus measures

[zambonir]

My former home of Austin, TX set a daily hospitalization record and a 7-day average hospitalization record today.

"States such as Arizona and Texas never got rid of the first wave..."

New coronavirus spread isn't the feared 'second wave' – it's still the first,...

[schillingfan]

I said this up thread. The east coast and upper Midwest got it through Travel from zEurope. We had community spread before everyone shut down and flattened our curve. But viruses spread. The west and south never got their their peak, because the virus didn’t spread to them widely. Now they have it. We’re going down nicely in the East. We respect and fear the virus. The rest of the country doesn’t appear to. If you go state by state, it’s a very different story than the overall number.

[LoneStarPhan]

I am afraid that there are far too many people who just will not accept a second shut down and stay home order.

A few weeks ago, I had hopes for a reasonable half season of baseball followed by an expanded playoff, but now that seems unlikely. It also seems likely that there are at least several players and coaches who have contacted the virus. Even if the owners and players can agree on a season, what happens when some test come back positive?

Player and MLB pitching coach tested positive for coronavirus

[zambonir]

I do think we're gonna have to live with the virus, sports included. The real problem here, as in most of American life these days, is the binary. It's been shutdown vs. "open up" almost from Day 1. I know a lot of people who say they won't do anything until there's a vaccine. That's not an option if it takes 2-3 years. But it's also not an option to live with the virus if people refuse to wear masks or practice mitigation. You can't simulaneously refuse to have a lockdown and refuse to wear a mask at Costco. The latter will lead us back to the former.