March 2024 Phillies Minor League Transactions

zambonir 2024-03-20 19:46:26 UTC #21

Like I said in my post, NIL will put a lot more kids in college. But that's not part of the "free ride" from the school itself (however fuzzy those lines might still be). They are not allowed to do this stuff directly.

zambonir 2024-03-20 19:51:41 UTC #22

That's probably gonna take a few years to play out. This march towards employee status and direct-pay seems inevitable. But until we get past November there's no way to know if that will actually run its course in labor's favor.

andyb 2024-03-20 19:54:08 UTC #23

If you don't think coaches tell boosters who should get paid more in football and basketball then I've got a bridge to sell you. Teams can't promise NIL money, but their boosters sure can and they'll give more to a 4-star recruit compared to a 3-star recruit.

Political campaigns are not allowed to coordinate with their Super PACs and independent expenditures either. But they do and its all legal (or there is an enforcing mechanism as weak as the current NCAA in place).

zambonir 2024-03-20 20:04:41 UTC #24

Of course. I just don't think baseball has that kind of money, and especially not for stars (and if it did it would already be a factor without NIL). A lot of the non-revenue NIL deals are really modest, or split equally amongst whole rosters. Even football players aren't getting $100-300K except for like, the 10 biggest guys in the country.

Austinfan 2024-03-20 20:10:44 UTC #25

The failure is not making it to AA as a solid starter, after that, most will still fail b/c even if they can hit a ML FB, many die when they face a steady diet of breaking balls in AAA. Same with pitchers, if you have ML stuff, you can make it to AA, but without command you won't go much further.

Failure to perform at A ball level suggests scouting failure in that the basic "stuff" wasn't there.

julio 2024-03-21 00:54:34 UTC #26

As Matt noted, the purge to make room under the Domestic Reserve Limit has begun. Two "trades for cash" and four releases listed today.

zambonir 2024-03-21 01:07:36 UTC #27

We've talked about them needing to expand the 26 and 40-man roster which I think is true but it would also make sense to have a permanent taxi squad. 3-4 guys who are paid more (basically what a team like the Phillies is already doing with certain players on split deals) don't have to go through waivers coming on and off the 40, and, on top of that, wouldn't count against the organizational minor league limit, which would then open up a few more spots at the bottom.

(I realize not everything about that would necessarily work in the players' favor, but most of it would I think. Collectively.)

andyb 2024-03-21 13:13:58 UTC #28

That is not correct. I imagine there are hundreds of players in that range. Probably closer to a thousand. The entire Villanova basketball team had a deal where everyone up to the last man got $75,000 and I am sure the starters got much more. There is much more money out there than you think. This money is also NOT tied exclusively to the revenue the sports generate. It is the notoriety of the athletes. And there are incentives for boosters to overpay players to come to the school. For them it is about winning and marketing, not profits.

It is not a representative survey, but basically 2/3 of 4 and 5 star recruits were making $100K or more. I'd imagine there are 100 baseball players at that level. Maybe a bit more. Add in partial scholarships and players are easily in that $100K-$200K range if they are top 10 round talents. And this is for 3 years, not a bonus. So a Logan O'Hoppe bonus could be exceeded with a package of only $80,000 a year (scholarship plus NIL money).

zambonir 2024-03-21 13:36:40 UTC #29

I dunno man, I know it's not tied to the revenue of sports per se but that is usually when the athletes have their own social media presence and sponsor interest, not from booster collectives. I follow some big baseball programs (Texas, Oregon/Oregon State) and just don't see the money or process that would really keep guys from going to MLB. Maybe those 11th-rounders.

If Villanova basketball players were getting $75K each I doubt a major baseball program would have more than half that (especially considering how many more players there are). It is more about augmenting the scholarships and competing with other schools (and doing the right thing, maybe) than inducing a recruit to not turn pro.

andyb 2024-03-21 13:44:44 UTC #30

The Villanova story.

$75,000 minimum. $3 million total for the team. So that is like $2 million extra on top of the $75K to the better players. Baseball is smaller of course and there are only 20-30 programs that have significant NIL deals, but it is certainly out there for maybe 100-200 players out of each high school class.

Austinfan 2024-03-21 14:39:19 UTC #31

College baseball doesn't get nearly the attention of football and basketball, so it's doubtful the same money will be available, boosters do it for ego, but there just isn't much bragging rights in college baseball - I'd say even college hockey gets more attention in the conferences where it's big. Example, Boston U.

zambonir 2024-03-21 15:07:36 UTC #32

Well, I actually think your Boston U example is instructive. There are certain baseball schools, like Cal State Fullerton or Dallas Baptist or even Lewis-Clark that probably have robust NIL programs. I just don't think it's very big money, nor are the money people at SEC or Big 12 schools putting that kind of funding into baseball.

It's a system that should really be more like hockey, where a drafted player can choose -with the team's input - whether to play college or pro. Of course in hockey "pro" is still not run by the NHL teams. Now they are saying Canadian major junior players will eventually preserve their NCAA eligibility. It would actually make a lot of sense if baseball wound up being the same. A kid could take a $200K bonus and get paid to play in the minors for a few years and then decide to go to college and still play. With NIL, what's the difference now?

andyb 2024-03-21 16:03:14 UTC #33

Never said it is huge money. But 100+ college players getting at least $100K is probably the reality. The college hockey programs you speak of are likely in that range too though there are more larger baseball programs than hockey programs.

It is about the marketing and not the revenue generated. And there is just little reason for any sub-$300K high school bonuses to exist any more. Guessing 80%+ of the high school signings will get bonuses of $500K+ or just go to college which is the better financial decision and often offers a sophisticated development path with more guaranteed playing time if you include summer ball.

allentown 2024-03-21 18:14:16 UTC #34

If there is significant NIL money for college baseball star players, and they offer this as part of recruiting package for incoming freshmen, then this would significantly weaken the quality of H.S. athletes available in the baseball draft, likely from around position 15 of first round through the 3rd round. Guys able to get bonuses in top half of first round likely continue to forego college. Most of those guys will have good college careers and enter draft as college juniors 3 years later. So... weaker drafts for three years and then same as now, except primo talent shifted more to college juniors.

andyb 2024-03-22 16:58:36 UTC #35

60-Day IL moves today take care of most of the rest of roster slimming, though obviously the final major league cuts could force more moves. Wen Hui Pan among the 60-day moves unfortunately. Dominic Pipkin too and he is really running out of time to be a prospect unfortunately for a guy who can hit the upper 90s in a bullpen role.

Rest of the 60 day IL moves have been made, so here are your long term pitching injuries (some longer than others)
Wen Hui Pan
Alex Garbrick
Alex McFarlane
Giussepe Velasquez
Nick Snyder
Dominic Pipkin
Andrew Painter
I have them now at 164 roster spots filled https://t.co/9sQQaqwsPV
— Matt Winkelman ( @Matt_Winkelman ) March 22, 2024

andyb 2024-03-24 23:30:32 UTC #36

Rixon Wingrove among the latest minor league cuts. Would have been fun if he could have made it, though he really needed a broader skillset and/or more time.

andyb 2024-03-28 19:24:05 UTC #37

Beau Burrows signed as another upper minors veteran starter. 27 years old. Was with the Braves last year in the minors and not particularly good. He did get a few limited major league stints but again was not that good. Seems depth more than anything. Guessing they had a couple of extra spots after putting 4 arms on the IL.