GDT 9/8/23 Miami Marlins (Pérez, Eu) @ Philadelphia Phillies (Sánchez, C)

[LoneStarPhan]

Sure seems like a game that could have been won, but the offense didn't really come through in a couple potential scoring situations and the bullpen gave up a couple home runs to give the Marlins just enough for the win.

The Phillies need to take the next two and win the series.

[Philsmania]

Games like this are why the Phillies will be watching October on TV. Our bullpen is HORRIBLE.

[Lucky_Beagle]

Without knowing any additional information about the player's... I would have started Sanchez in the 6tb inning hoping he could get through it on 15-18 pitches. K owing the team is started 6 straight days of games with a DH included I wouldn't want to have had to use 4 relief pitchers if it needed.

[Philsmania]

Thomson is very weak on x's and o's.

[gmwannabe]

Tough game to lose. saw bits and pieces with friends over for dinner. Saw they were up 2-0 and Sanchez was looking pretty good. Is he too fragile too to pitch more than 5 innings?? Especially with this bullpen. Seranthony has not come back all the way ( not sure if he will) from the surgery. This bullpen will be the downfall of this season for the Phils. I have a sneaking feeling that last night's loss could be the beginning of a very unhappy weekend for Philadelphia sports. I hope I am wrong.
gm

[allentown]

The bullpen has actually been good for most of the season. Dominguez and Strahm still have decent ERAs and the guys with ERAs above 4.50 each threw perfect innings. I wouldn't say Sanchez is fragile, although he has been injured, but he was at 82 pitches and likely hits 100 if he goes 6 IP. A lot of pitchers aren't cut out to throw 100 pitches in a game.

[zambonir]

While the bullpen did in fact lose this game - and the Marlins' bullpen, including David Robertston, won it - I'd say most 3-2 losses are not on the pitchers.

The bullpen that we think was pretty good last year was actually held together with duct tape in the playoffs once they got past the short series. This one is still better, man for man, but will likely be held together with duct tape in the playoffs too. One reliever having a bad night or week can always cost you a postseason series. Happened to the Cardinals and Padres against us, and Alvarado got rocked twice against the Astros.

The extra starters are much better too. Last year Falter got a start and Kyle Gibson actually pitched an inning in the NLCS and the WS and Eflin had to replace Knebel and they trusted Suarez more than most of the relievers besides Alvarado and Seranthony. Sanchez and Lorenzen are more promising and pretty much everyone in the current likely playoff pen, while not always easy to watch, is better than Hand and Bellatti and probably Brogdon.

[Austinfan]

Sanchez can go 100+ pitches, but he's past his career high in innings pitched already (129 between AAA and Philly, compare to 85 and 57 the two previous seasons) and probably has 3-4 more starts, so I think they want to "baby" him the rest of the way. Was throwing harder with extra rest, but he's going to be 60-70 IP above his previous high. So it makes sense.

150 IP this season, and keep him healthy, b/c he may have to start 30+ games next season (no Painter, Abel and McGarry starting in AAA ball, Nola a potential FA . . . ).

[Sabin]

There are some statements that work better individually than collectively here. For example, I'd agree that many 3-2 losses aren't entirely the fault of poor pitching.. but your later mention of Alvarado under pitchers whose bad night(s) cost their teams a series ignores that in both outings against the Astros where he surrendered runs the Phillies lost 0-5 and 1-4, games where I imagine you'd be quick to point out the lack of production from the bats largely made the runs Alvarado allowed irrelevant.

Your point that a bad relief performance sinking a team's chances is valid, but a bit obvious. Whether in a truncated WC series or the competitive level presented by the DS/WS, every mistake is amplified. And I would argue that nearly all teams are employing a form of duct tape by season's end, especially toward the bottom of their bullpen.

[zambonir]

Hmmh, you think the offense should bear some of the blame for World Series Game 4?

Also, when I thought about it again both the Suarez appearance for the Padres and Alvarado's second appearance in the WS were arguably managerial errors. Hader should have had Harper and Wheeler should have stayed in the game.

But the interesting thing about the Alvarado appearances in the World Series is that they were in the 5th inning of a 3-0 game (that may well have been unwinnable) and the 6th inning of a 1-0 game. I think we'd remember them a lot worse had they been in the 8th or 9th, understandably. Last night, at least the bats had given the Phillies a lead before Seranthony blew it, and a tie before Strahm did. So sure, it's on both things, but GM is the one who said the bullpen was terrible and be the "downfall of this season." Was debating his post, not one you hadn't made yet.

[Sabin]

Was debating his post, not one you hadn't made yet.

You don't say.

I don't necessarily disagree with your response in general to GM. I think the bullpen has been solid the bulk of the season. And if you're saying any bullpen can have its share of ups and downs through a given season, I agree as well.

If GM's concern is that things look shaky in there the past couple of weeks, and that if they don't get corrected they could spell the doom of the Phillies in the postseason, I don't disagree; but while I do have some concern over a Kimbrel given his age/usage (Lorenzen as well given his past four appearances though he almost undoubtedly see a role change in the postseason) I've seen these type of rollercoaster bullpen rides before, and am holding out hope for the likes of Dominguez and Alvarado to regain their footing over the next two weeks.

[zambonir]

Let's face it (crossing into tonight's game), it's all about Nola. And/or the offense winning a few 10-2 games.

[Sabin]

I'm worrying much more about Nola than the rest of the staff at this point simply because of his importance to the rotation. With tonight's game he's failed to reach a full five innings in three of his last eight starts, and another two he only managed 5.0. His ERA over that span is north of 5.8.