GDT 6/13/25 Toronto Blue Jays (Gausman) @ Philadelphia Phillies (Suárez, Ra)

[Austinfan]

Ranger making it hard on Dombrowski, he'll be 30, they have no cap room until 2026 if they re-up Schwarber unless they let Realmoto walk (with Kepler that would free up $30M minus the cost of a new catcher and Schwarber's raise).

But he's a proven post-season pitcher and right now the best pitcher on the team.
That Nola extension really biting them in the butt right now.

[VoteForKalas]

Great win.

Good to see extra base hits and power from the offense along with adding on runs throughout the game instead of one inning.

Wheeler is our best pitcher, one of the best in baseball. Suarez did very well and hopefully he can keep it going. With Nola injured and Sanchez less reliable than last season, not to mention the weaker pen, it would be great to have Suarez stay consistent.

[zambonir]

I went to the game last night and while this is hardly news, man, the Phillies are just an incredibly white team. I usually sit upstairs down the 3B line but had really good lower level seats behind home yesterday so it just became more noticeable/striking - looking straight-on at a Latin or Black pitcher surrounded by eight white guys (well, Nick is half-Cuban), for all nine innings and that was still without Harper. Never mind the history and culture of the franchise, we've talked about that plenty, or even the dearth of Black American players in MLB - for me it just really highlighted the Phillies' failure to produce Latin American position players.

If Ranger decides his biggest priority is returning to the Phillies they could consider it but it would probably mean trading Luzardo, who's is still younger, and, for one year, cheaper. Ditto Sanchez (and cheaper for even longer). If he hits the open market, he's gone (unless he stays unsigned for a long time due to QO, than you never know. It's just nice that it will be easy for the Phillies to offer a QO. Hey he could always take it!)

[allentown]

Ranger making it hard on Dombrowski, he'll be 30, they have no cap room until 2026 if they re-up Schwarber unless they let Realmoto walk (with Kepler that would free up $30M minus the cost of a new catcher and Schwarber's raise).

But he's a proven post-season pitcher and right now the best pitcher on the team.
That Nola extension really biting them in the butt right now.

Wheeler is 35, Nola is 32. Ranger is 29 and Sanchez is 28 -- they are both needed as the veteran, plus starters to replace Wheeler and Nola going forward. Painter and Abel are the young, hopefully plus, starters, who will benefit from having Ranger and Sanchez ahead of them in the rotation.

Next year, Bohm will be gone, the year after that Castellanos, and then Wheeler. Likely we also lose Realmuto during that period. If the owners and DD want to extend the window for contention, then it makes no sense to lose Ranger. He is a key part of our rotation and this team is built around its starting rotation, Harper, and Schwarber. It's hard and expensive to build a quality starting rotation. We need to keep Ranger, Sanchez, Painter, and Able to maintain that edge. Ownership missed the boat in the last golden age, when they refused to go a measly $6 mill over budget for a single year to have a super rotation post-2008, anchored on Halladay, Lee, and Hamels with the offensive core still strong. The owners need to bite the budget bullet for one year, possibly two. We also need to not trade the young players who are likeliest to provide cheap, major league help over the next several seasons: Painter, Able, Crawford, DeMartini, Miller, Escobar.

[andyb]

Lots of time before we need to decide whether we want to keep Ranger. As I said, he is probably the second-most trusted pitcher on this staff, so even though it would cost money, one can never have enough pitching and both sides may very well want to continue in Philly.

[zambonir]

Next year, Bohm will be gone, the year after that Castellanos,

Bohm is still controlled by the Phillies next year, same as Casty (just via arb not contract). They both hit FA the same year. It's possible one or both of them is gone sooner, just different paths to do so (Bohm, non-tender or modest trade, Casty, traded only if major $ picked up).

I just don't see how they keep both Ranger and Luzardo longer term. I think they are far more interested in keeping both JT and Schwarber and then they are still thin in LF to boot. Maybe the arrival of Crawford and Miller and/or moving Turner to another position addresses that, maybe not.

Some have said that Middleton won't be satisified if this team doesn't seriously contend for a championship this year, but he and his new minority investors have to show they really feel that way. Having already blown past all the most punitive tax thresholds, simply paying a little more in salary and tax shouldn't stop them. But I don't blame them for not handling Ranger $100 million (and don't forget they still have, and are paying Walker next year too). As luxurious as it has been to have this rotation depth, it's more than they need. And the gap between the Dodgers/Mets and Philliies is not a product of payroll different. The Mets have a better rotation overall without any single pitcher who could be the 4th starter here, though maybe that's moving in our direction with Ranger back.

Now, if Nola ends up with longer-term injury or performance issues, that is where they would have to spend the money like they chose not too once Halladay and Lee (and Howard) were all non-factors. But they are not going to keep Ranger IMO if all the members of the current rotation look to be in the mix next year. Even if they they trade Abel.

[Florida_Sunshine]

I think you might be surprised.

[VoteForKalas]

Amaro was on WIP today and stated, if he was GM, his priority order would be Schwarber first, Realmuto next and then Suarez

[zambonir]

I don't think Amaro has any inside information, he can just see what's been in front of everyone for the past year. Boras clients always hit the open market unless the player heavily insists otherwise. A year ago at this time Ranger probably wasn't interested in early extension/hometown discounts. A month later, the Phillies probably weren't going to offer one. Since then they've tried to trade for Crochet last deadline, tried to trade Bohm for pitching in the off-season, and traded for Luzardo. Even the Sanchez extension felt a bit like a warning shot/negotiating ploy. You can never have too much pitching (nor, for a change, LH starters) but to me that still says they were simply not planning for a future with Ranger, whether because he can't be relied on health-wise (still not clear) or was going to price himself out if he could be.Talk of moving him to pen (as early as March) or trading him (as recently as last week) never made much sense to me but keeping him still seems unlikely.

[Florida_Sunshine]

The team is better with him so consider him to be a rental that we did not have to pay for. But if a great trade offer comes along, and the rest of our pitching is good, go for it.

[zambonir]

Oh I wouldn't trade him. I just don't think he'll be here next year.

He's been a godsend given Nola's Injury and Luzardo's hiccup, and will continue to be so if Abel's next few starts look more like #3 than #1.

[allentown]

Well, RAJ is from the era that let the team grow old after 2008 and left an emptied farm and a decade of losing after the last successful regular season in 2011. An example of how not to extend a winning team without totally selling out the future.

[zambonir]

As you somewhat noted I think Ruben would have been pretty successful had he been given both free rein (he was certainly not the force behind the Howard extension) and deeper pockets. He wasn't really the guy who wrecked the farm or traded away too many kids (some, but the damage was mostly done before him). Imagine if that team had the money to keep Werth, hadn't traded Lee (which would have meant not trading for Oswalt too), weren't desperate to get under the tax when things went bad in 2012 (of course Pence wouldn't have even been on that team to dump) and didn't start pinching pennies on the likes of Revere and Delmon Young as they tried to extend the window. Even the Utley and Chooch extensions could have worked if the pitchers had held up. Dombrowski has not traded away prospects at near the same level as Gillick or Amaro either. Unfortunately that's also because he couldn't (and because the QO compensation isn't quite as punitive now).