2023 Phillies Regular Season Discussion Part 2

[Matt_Winkelman]

Cash Considerations

[phillychuck]

I think his brother Monetary Considerations had a better bat and was a step quicker. At least we traded the right brother.

[phillychuck]

Hicklen had a really good AAA season in 2022 and got called up. He really regressed in 2023, having arguably his worst minor league year. Not a bad AAAA player, actually.

[andyb]

Almost a 30-30 guy last year in AAA but lots of swing and miss (202 Ks!).

[Jazzhead]

Hicklen looks like an intriguing, and rare, power-speed combination, I saw an interview with him, he seems like a good fellow. He just might fit in here.

[zambonir]

Seems like he's just here to play for the Iron Pigs until the season's over. Unlikely he moves ahead of Pache or Rojas, or gets added to the 40 in the off-season (which will make him a free agent). Obviously the Royals had already decided not to add him either and figured they'd do him a favor of finishing the year with a AAA team playing meaningful games.

[bkox]

yeah.. if he cant make the Royals he isnt gonna make the Phillies..

[David_Criss]

I find it very strange the Royals couldn't find room for him on their squad this year.

[zambonir]

I mean, ya never know, maybe they like him and he comes back on a minor league deal or he goes on a tear in the AAA playoffs and gets himself a look from someone else. But yeah. '

I suppose there is a tiny chance this says something about Pache's setback and they'd consider him as a PR or more useful piece than Castro.

[David_Criss]

Why not just add Kingery if you wanted some speed? Who gets added in a few days is anyones guess:
Ellis, Hall, Clemens, Wilson or Muzzioti. Then again they will prob stick with what they have and just add Pache and Suarez, but who knows if they will be ready by Sept. 1.

[zambonir]

Because he's not on the 40? There's no room on the 40 currently, it's 40+Hoskins, so right now neither Kingery nor this guy are coming up.

But yeah, if Pache isn't ready by 9/1 you never know (on any of those guys). Suarez probably won't be ready by 9/1 so they'll just bring back another reliever. Ideally he's back by 9/11 when they have a doubleheader and will still need a 6th starter. After that they'll have to decide if Sanchez is staying in the major league pen or if he and Lorenzen might tandem or if they'll send him down to stay on turn. Suarez may be in that tandem scenario as well.

And does Covey make it to the season's end/the playoff roster? We shall see!

[bkeich]

My guess is that he is done doing this, but it might be interesting to see Lorenzen sonetimes used as a PH. He has a career .710 OPS in about 100 PA, but it has been a few years. He has good power and actually is pretty fast (or used to be). He certainly could PR for a few of our very slow runners.

My guess is that they won't do that much, but his dual use is possible. He isn't Ohtani obviously, but he isn't a joke either, although it was more of a consideration a few years ago.

[zambonir]

Inquirer just did a big story on him

Before Shohei Ohtani, Michael Lorenzen wanted to be a two-way player. But he’s...

Talks about how he was annoyed the Reds asked him to make an Ohtani sales pitch video at the same time they weren't really letting him do it as much as he wanted.

Mostly it talks about how it's not worth the injury risk. The first time he pitched in 2021 (after missing 91 games with a shoulder strain) he stayed in the game as an OF and hurt his hamstring tagging up from third base and missed another 11 games. That's the last time he did it.

Would the Phillies consider letting him hit?

“No,” manager Rob Thomson said before the question was fully asked.

Lorenzen has made his peace with perhaps never getting the chance again.

Ultimately it says that since he hopes to remain a starter and not go back to being a reliever, the additional focus and strain of hitting isn't worth it to him. The Angels also refused to let him do it because they couldn't have two two-way players.

[andyb]

I don't think they are really concerned about the 40-man spots. There are probably at least 3-5 players where the Phillies have already decided they are not going to keep them on the roster all winter. So if they wanted Kingery they could just get him. They'll probably just add Wilson or Hall and not play them much if Pache is not ready.

For the playoffs I am wondering if they will really think about Hoskins at some point as a pinch hitter/DH only. Probably only in the later rounds, but that might be an excuse to go with 14 hitters and 12 pitchers. There are enough off days and they will have 2-3 starters in the bullpen to really not be concerned with the 13th pitcher.

[zambonir]

Gelb said Hoskins is a factor but only with a deep playoff run. Probably not before NLCS.

We assumed they'd go one extra bench guy/one fewer pitcher last year but I don't recall that they actually did? I just know Hall never got consideration and I reckon that is still the case (i.e. we'd see Clemens or Wilson).

At some point won't the Phillies actually want to see the Iron Pigs make a playoff run, and send some guys up from AA too? Major league team always comes first and of course it's not a prospect-laden AAA team (which is also not that unusual) but also better to leave a few vets down there to help then bring them up for the amount of playing time Wilson and Castro have gotten so far.

[Callison]

The talk about Hoskins coming back sounds like a real long shot. Even if by some miracle he finds his game, where is he gonna play? PH?

Yesterday's game looked like another day at the office for the Phils, like many hoped they'd play against everybody all season. They looked real good and you expect more today. Bet cautious. HUGE hit for Stubbs! OTOH, I've kept hopeful for Cave but he turned in another ofer - moments of promise followed by nothing. Big Rob has given him his shot. May be the consummate AAAA player. C'mon, Jake, HTMFB!!! Or you'll be GONE!!! Sanchez getting lots of respect.

Though Ohtani may have lost millions with his latest injury, he'll never know they're missing when he signs his new contract. Doubt it will be with The Angels, who gambled keeping him and gambled further with trade deadline signings, but they're 3-7 over the last 10 and under .500... all for nothing. Can't say I blame the Angels for keeping him, though, and with that decision, might as well go all in and acquire the talent available to make a run.

[EDmuch]

Ohtani goes to Dodgers or Mariners

[bkox]

[zambonir]

How the Phillies played last night is not how they should play all the time but it is how they should play all the time at home against a team as bad as the Cardinals (and the Angels). Hopefully it continues. The first six games of September (@Milwaukee, @Padres) could still be bumpy (Padres stink but West Coast is always hard).

[Callison]

There is some good news regarding Ohtani's next team - the Angels have said they won't trade him to the Dodgers!!! And his interpreter has reportedly said he wants to remain on the west coast, so the NYY are OUT!!!

I think SF gets him. SF has "Japan Town" where he'll surely feel at home away from home. They have the cash and the prospects to trade.

Seattle might seem to be in the sweepstakes, but I recall some rock star's comments after moving to Seattle: "It's like being married to a beautiful woman who's sick all the time." ...meaning it rains nearly all the time. I doubt Ohtani will want any part of that.