2023-2024 Sixers Season

[zambonir]

Sorry....Morey isn't the issue.

But for us as Sixers fans Morey totally is the issue. He wanted nothing more than to bring James Harden here, it took him two tries, he wheeled and dealed last year to get him under contract (and lost two draft picks for tampering with the players he paid with the money saved on Harden's deal) and ended up with a team that was no better than the ones in 2021 or 2022. On top of that he thought firing Doc would make Harden happy. Doesn't matter if he misjudged, misread or misled Harden (and really, he's done all three). This is where it got him.

Harden will probably still get traded and maybe the season won't be wasted, especially if Harris can either step up or be traded for something himself. But that would be a surprise. And meanwhile they're either wasting more of Joel's prime or laying the groundwork for his own departure.

[phillychuck]

z, you can't judge Morey entirely by his handling of Harden. The team last year WAS better than the previous teams. If they close the door in game 6 at home (if Tatum, who had stunk all series, doesn't get firecracker hot in the second half of that game), they get through round 2 and are in position to make the finals. Morey has magically wiggled out of the Horford/Richardson mess, drafted pretty well when he has picks, signed some good role players, traded for Melton who looks valuable, and managed to trade Simmons for an actual player even though that player has warts. I personally don't think Morey is the issue, and I'm interested to see what he does in the post-Harden era.

[zambonir]

I'm not saying "fire Morey" or anything. But if you want James Harden on your team he's going to be James Harden. Morey either forget that or thought he could change that.

I think it's debatable whether the team actually was better. I mean yeah, if a few things went differently in the playoffs maybe they have more success but you can say that about the Hawks series in 2021 too (both Embiid's health, as usual, and Simmons' play. Plus they were the #1 seed. Still Morey's team, of course).

But are they going to be better this coming season?

[VoteForKalas]

I have to agree with zambonir on Morey.

When he was hired, we were supposedly getting a savvy, experienced, well connected and dynamic GM that would finally build a great team around Embiid and get us past our 2nd round hurdle.

I feel he has underdelivered in almost every facet. The two best players are Embiid and Maxey, both of whom predated his arrival. Doc was not his direct hire, but they did come in the same year and Morey gave him 3 years before realizing what was suspected after year 1 and glaringly obvious after year 2.

Yes, he inherited the Simmons debacle and was able to get Harden in return by giving up draft power & another usable player in Curry. On the face of it, it looked defendable, but Harden was clearly not the same player and had proven multiple times that he was a team cancer. The only reason he was available from the Nets is because he refused to play until traded. Even Morey, who evidently is biased in favor of Harden, should have seen the signs.

Harden played ok for the 76ers, but it became mostly a lateral move from Simmons and left us with little depth. Morey helped that with Melton, but most of the team's improvement derived from Embiid and Maxey's development on the court. I think those players, Doc and the assistants probably deserve most of that credit.

Morey has not done anything about the bad fit of Harris nor resolved the backup C issue although we'll have to see what happens with Reed staying nor has he been able to get a true PG and stretch 3 to maximize this offense. Meanwhile, the defense which had kept the 76ers competitive during their rise has slid and, while still decent, it was exposed by several playoff opponents.

I'm not confident this season will be much different. Harden will be traded at some point for peanuts (his value has never been lower) and Embiid & Maxey will again be called on to carry the team. Harris will do his usual tease and fade routine and the bench guys will do their best, but unless Morey pulls off a miracle I see no progress.

[zambonir]

Either he's covering for himself and Morey or the comment seems like an over-the-top response. Guess it also depends how you define "quickly." And if Harden really only expected to be traded to one team (two before the Heat pivoted to Dame I guess).

As part of NBA probe into his “liar” comment, James Harden told league investigators he was referring to Daryl Morey telling Harden he will trade him “quickly” following the $35.6 million opt in for 2023-24, per sources. The 76ers’ stance now is they expect to keep Harden.

— Shams Charania ( @ShamsCharania ) August 21, 2023

[bigegypt0417]

So are they better next season? I'm pretty sure we know the answer to that is an emphatic "NO".

Are they going to be a team with far more flexibility after this next season? I think the answer to that is 100% "YES"

Morey was handed a team with so many warts and I think he's done a good job of keeping them competitive but the issue is today what it always seems to be...Embiid is always hurt in the playoffs(that is probably an exaggeration) and Morey is going to have to figure that part out.

The sixers will shed some bad contracts and essentially have Embiid and Maxey to build around in 2024...not sure what happens but this next season will not be the best...

[bkeich]

But as the clock keeps moving back Embiid just gets older and even more fragile. Add that to the fact that he is probably right on the edge of requesting a trade, the 2023 early exit from the playoffs probably pushes him over the edge of saying "I demand a trade".

Honestly last year was the chance, but the team fell short. Just because we will be out from under the Harris contract does not mean we can find a better player to add.

[bigegypt0417]

At the end of the day is it really possible for Embiid to be more fragile? I guess he could but i'm afraid to know what that looks like.

I'm always conflicted on Embiid because at this point in his career is he more valuable here or as a substantial trade piece?

I'm not really sure I have the answer to that question...

[zambonir]

Athletic already did a huge story about who the Sixers could sign after 2024 but the Joel question remains either way (should they trade him, will he want a trade, will they ever really win a title during his time here).

I don't think 2024 is cooked yet though. They will trade Harden for mostly picks even if the return is light and then they will have those picks and Harris at the deadline if they think they can make a run (whether they are 11th, 8th or 5th at that point). If not, it moves to the next thing.

[xogfog]

Sixers are signing Kelly Oubre Jr.

Sixers expected to sign free agent Kelly Oubre Jr.

[bkeich]

Can't be excited about Oubre, the 20ppg looks interesting but he is not a good shooter. He is a terrible 3pt shooter who shoots way too often. If he never shot another 3 (and he should not) he might be ok statistically, but of course that means his percentage would fall because the lack of threat of shooting from deep.

20ppg because he played on a terrible team.

[phillychuck]

It's just not true that he's horrible 3-point shooter. His career percentage is 33%, which translates to 50% true shooting from 3, and he has been responsible for end of the shot clock situations, which are necessarily forced. With more than 5 seconds left on the shot clock he shoots 35%, and he shoots almost 38% on catch-and-shoot 3s. He has a very low turnover percentage, and has been a very good defensive player, although his effort on that end has been inconsistent with Charlotte. I'm sort of interested to see how he mixes in with the Sixers' core. Without Harden, they could run a lineup of Maxey, Melton, Oubre, Harris, and Embiid which could be quite productive both offensively and defensively.

[zambonir]

Once they are actually without Harden - whenever that may be - they will certainly have some other players, whether directly or by using the assets they get for him. That being the case, buying low on Oubre makes perfect sense. And if Harden actually doesn't play for the Sixers and hasn't been traded I'd say Oubre more than clears the bar for just adding someone in the meantime.

[bkeich]

Out of 149 qualifiers last year, Oubre was 144th in 3pt Shooting. I would stick with my word, that is horrible. He shot 31.9% last year, near his career mark of 33.0%.

You are correct, his true shooting percentage from his 33% would be right at 50%. That is bad. Last year, that landed him 134th out of 149. (Oddly enough his 2pt shooting was a little better at .510 versus .470 for 3pt, I used eFG which is half of true shooting minus the free throws)

Oubre also had only 54 assists last year. Agreed, one could argue he had no one to pass too, but those are Manure Bol type assist numbers. Ok, not quite Bol, but of the Sixers players that played 20 minutes/game, only Tucker was worse at assists. In fact every other player was at least double his rate. (Niang was just short of 20ppg and would also be worse)

The standard has changed. 1.00 pt per possession is no longer even close to being good. Since the Warriors run and gun offense spread through the league, the points per possession are way, way up.

Statistically, Oubre is very near the bottom of the league despite the 20ppg because, well, he shot a lot.

(Wow, does my auto correct not want to use the word Niang)

[phillychuck]

I understand your point, but guys who are horrible 3-point shooters don't end up as qualifiers. Thybulle, Ish Smith, McConnell, Springer, Furk, etc. don't qualify. Those guys are horrible. Oubre was statistically at the bottom of the guys who shoot enough to qualify, sure. But that misses the context of him being forced to take a lot of late-clock 3s and guarded 3s due to Charlotte's awful offense. His catch and shoot guarded percentage (% of shots where he was guarded) was third-highest in the league. He shot 32% on the catch-and-shoot guarded 3s and 38% on the open 3s. He will get a lot more open 3s on the Sixers as a percentage. As long as he plays within the system and doesn't force guarded shots he will be more efficient. And he's a really good athlete who will run the floor (which Nurse wants to do) and force turnovers. It's a good vet minimum signing.

[zambonir]

It's a good vet minimum signing.

David Murphy yesterday:

There is no such thing as a bad minimum deal. In that context, this counts as a good signing.

But I would agree. Is he taking away a roster spot, playing time, cap space or a role from a better player? If not, it's a good signing even if he fails. Especially if there isn't anyone left out there who is better to add. This is also probably not a deal that happens if Harden situation was normal (plus there's the whole Harden/Oubre conspiracy theory which if true either means Morey is trolling James or he just knows James is never stepping on the court for the Sixers again).

Kelly Oubre can help the Sixers, but he’ll need to be a player he’s never been

[xogfog]

Lillard traded to Bucks, now the pressure moves to the 76ers to either reconcile with Harden or trade him. Lillard did not go to the Heat, so Harden would look bad if he insists on going to the Clippers.

Sources: Lillard heading to Bucks in 3-team deal

[zambonir]

I'm sure James would happily go to the Heat. Do they have anything? And should they plan the parade in Milwaukee or will the Bucks actually turn into last year's Sixers?

[xogfog]

The Heat don't really have anything interesting. I think it would take a three team trade for the Sixers to get anything significant back, like maybe the Bulls for DeRozan or LaVine.

[xogfog]

Interesting thought related to an Athletic article I just read.

If the Clippers trade directly with Portland for Holilday, they would no longer be interested in Harden. Would Harden then realize he has nowhere else to go and make good with the Sixers for this next season? I really think his best situation is here and I really don't think any other team wants him, unless the Heat, now that they lost out on Lillard are willing to take Harden for a package based on Herro plus picks.